Josep Castells: "Majorcan centralism does not want to rule, what it wants is not to be bothered"

Palma"I have never had to vote for something different from what I believed." Josep Castells (Barcelona, 1970) made this reflection in September, when he announced that he would leave politics at the end of the term, after 12 years as a deputy for Més per Menorca in the Parliament. He acknowledges that maintaining coherence is a privilege in current times, when many politicians are subject to the discipline of state parties. And he also emphasizes that, despite everything he has experienced during these three terms, he still maintains the naivety of thinking that things can be changed, even if only a little.

What do you know now that you did not imagine when you entered Parliament almost 12 years ago?

— Well, parliamentary work is much more useful than people think, even in the opposition. Often it is not so much what you achieve as what you avoid. This is also thanks to the media, which amplify the work we do here and often make governments not even dare to propose certain things. I have understood the authority that the Parliament has in a democratic society.

Do you think that this work does not reach the citizens many times?

— It does not reach the citizenry because people have many other things to do before informing themselves, unfortunately. We must assume that people are not willing to make the necessary time investment to exercise active citizenship. We form a necessary tandem with the media, and we try to ensure that people know what the issues that really affect them are. But in general terms it is difficult to reach them because people are too lazy to inform themselves politically.

What are the most relevant changes you have seen in the way politics is done?

— Before, there was a much more honest confrontation of ideas. Now, due to the influence of far-right populism, the right pretends to do one thing, in order to continue with what it has done all its life. The narrative is very important. This happens with the limitation of cars: the right does not want us to take this banner from them. It is a purely electoral strategy issue. The right wants to seize this banner and will later set a limit on cars that will be almost non-existent. It also happens with tourism growth. They want to be the great apostles of tourism containment, while with the other hand they continue increasing the number of places, the pressure, the saturation. There is this great change: the discourses are no longer transparent.

Has the discursive level of politicians declined?

— I haven't seen much difference since I started. But I agree that the debate is quite poor, because party discipline makes everyone stick to a script. The deputies really don't have room for negotiation, for reaching agreements. Everything is very rigid.

There is also a feeling of more tension.

— Totally. The simplification of discourse due to social media has caused nuance to be lost. The level of discussion is much poorer, because it is much more polarized. In the end, we all fall into it. We want to make a 10-second slogan. This is necessarily impoverishing, because you have no choice but to summarize a very complex debate into a slogan.

How much of the tension is real and how much is pantomime?

— I believe there is truly a sincere confrontation of ideas. And there is a good personal relationship. It is a necessary element if we want to engage in truly constructive politics. Often, a good personal relationship allows you to reach agreements and achieve small miracles, such as the Airport Co-management Law, because it turns out that we are capable of finding a common playing field with the PP and making a proposal out of it.

Don't you think that, in this case, the PP is taking advantage of a window of political opportunism?

— Yes, surely. But the important thing is that we have achieved a milestone, a majority in the Parliament of the Balearic Islands to request airport co-management. Until now, it had not been done. This quote is very well-known, but Churchill said that time is more important in politics than in grammar. The moment conditions us all, and a specific historical moment allows for things that another moment does not. The context and circumstances have made the airport co-management law possible in this case.

You have said that you have never voted against what you believe. Have other deputies had to go through this ordeal?

— They told me in confidence, in a low voice. Deputies who have spoken ill against their party because they do not agree with it.

Both right-wing and left-wing?

— Yes.

And what do you tell them?

— I offer them my shoulder to cry on [laughs].

Have you sacrificed a lot on a personal level to participate in regional politics?

— I have made a great sacrifice, with much anxiety and suffering. You cannot imagine how hard it is for a deputy who is not from Mallorca to do this job. In my case, in a small group, we always have to take on many commissions. I calculate that I must have taken the floor about a thousand times these 12 years. I have had to make many sacrifices because I have prioritized my personal life, the role of a father, and the relationship with my children. This has entailed many efforts for me, working at ungodly hours, flying back and forth, flights that I missed because I had to give dinner to my children... I have suffered this a lot. But I am very clear that I have been here because I wanted to.

Do you still consider yourself an idealist?

— I still say it, yes. They know I am very naive and I hope never to lose that. If I have to come here with the cynicism of knowing that everything is decided by four de facto powers and that we are performing in a theater, that is bad. We must reclaim naivety as the attitude of the citizen who expects us to govern public affairs for the benefit of the general interest. I continue to be an idealist, with my feet on the ground. We have a very small part of the power. The power is held by those de facto powers I mentioned, organized through lobbies that, furthermore, control the media. Citizens should make an effort and not vote so much for parties of the system. They should be capable of truly challenging the de facto powers, which try to keep everything the same because they benefit from the system. I am talking about the rentier, real estate, and tourism lobbies... We must be idealists because, if not, it is just coming here to put on a show. We can make them uncomfortable.

Has Mallorcan centralism diminished in Balearic politics?

— For practical purposes, yes, partly thanks to the fact that the island councils have their own powers. However, there is a curious attitude among Mallorcan politicians regarding the rest of the Islands, as if it has nothing to do with them. It is a kind of indifference. I see it more as a cultural attitude rather than centralist politics. I always compare it to Spanish nationalism, which wants to rule from Madrid. On the other hand, Mallorcan centralism does not want to rule; what it wants is not to be bothered. That is the difference.

Is the capacity of the legislative power diminishing?

— Yes. It is a global problem of imbalance between the executive, which wants control, and the legislative. Debates are often just a mere formality. Just this Tuesday in the Finance Committee, we authorized the Government to spend 348 million euros over the next 15 years on air transport for patients with a report of only two pages. This happens because the Government knows it has the majority. The lack of independence of the legislative branch with respect to the executive is one of the problems of our democratic model.

You have a reputation for preparing your interventions well, for reading a lot and doing your homework. Are you an exception to that?

— There are many types of deputies. I am a generalist, I have to speak about everything because I am on many committees. There are other deputies who are very specialized in one subject. In large groups, there are some who take advantage of it and others who do not manage to achieve it [smiles].

What is more important to achieve things in Parliament: making good interventions or corridor conversations?

— Good interventions are useful if the media amplifies them. If not, they are of no use. I have been well valued for this subject, but I am aware that it has very short legs. Persuasion, negotiation, knowing how to play your cards well, and using the mechanisms that the regulations give you are necessary. Every negotiation is like a card game. Bluffing, being able to put the other person against the ropes, allows the negotiation to turn out better. If you are not a good player and you don't have that cunning, you're in trouble. There is also the arithmetic. If you don't have the votes to block arithmetically, you have a very limited margin. Everything is important, you have to use a range of skills to achieve a good result in a negotiation.

Would you have ever imagined ending your career with an extreme right-wing President of the Parliament?

— No, but we see that it is a phenomenon that has come to stay and we are already normalizing it. However, when I started in Balearic politics, I could not think that the extreme right would eventually have such a decisive weight. A character like Jorge Campos, who was a bit of an operetta figure back then, ends up having positions of power. And this president... Regardless of what we may think about him being from the extreme right, he is a gentleman who took 72 days to convene the Permanent Deputation of the Parliament [the body that guarantees the continuity of the Chamber's functions during vacation periods or between ordinary sessions]. This is very damaging to the proper democratic functioning. Vox has a pathetic parliamentary activity, with a high rate of absenteeism. Many times they are not there, they present very few initiatives, and they come to repeat like a parrot what they are told from Madrid. They act as a transmission belt for what Mr. Abascal tells them.

This legislative term you are confronting Marga Prohens, who has gone from praise to reproaches towards you.

— Yes. I have noticed a sharper attitude, which often borders on rudeness. She does not have the behavior that would be expected. She is not very presidential, with a somewhat vulgar attitude improper for a president.

Menorca has been a model in terms of territory protection. Is this being lost?

— We have the consequences of the policies we implement. Menorca has managed to avoid becoming like Ibiza or some parts of Mallorca, but all of this can be lost. Now everyone realizes that those of us who say no to everything have managed to preserve what was intended to be the pattern for the other islands, a pattern of conservation, non-growth, and respect for the environment. Even so, we have not achieved 100% of our territory preservation goals and we face many threats. For example, there are now plans to build desalination plants to continue growing. Because, despite Menorca's territory preservation model, our aquifers are exhausted. We have not had enough power to prevent these consequences from occurring.

What has surprised you positively about your political opponents?

— The PP tends to have a quite elegant attitude regarding matters of parliamentary functioning. For example, during the pandemic, when we had to reduce attendance in the plenary hall, the PP had no problem yielding some of its seats to the small groups.

And any unpleasant surprise from allied parties?

— If the PSOE can be called an ally, it is that they gifted a hotel to the Nadal family. Now they are protesting and the whole story. But, through an amendment to the Housing Law, they converted a student residence into a hotel for them. Everyone has to bear their own legacy. It surprised me that they were capable of reaching that point. Seen from Menorca, it seems mind-blowing that this could happen.

You were talking about the de facto powers earlier. Has the Balearic political class been cowardly in this regard?

— More than cowardly, it is simply surrendered. For example, the first decree of urgent measures regarding housing [of this legislature] had the same ones as Proimba, which is the lobby of real estate developers, had posted on its website. I don't know what Aznar and FAES will do in Madrid, but the think tanks of the Balearic PP are these actors, the real estate employers' association, the representatives of the rentiers, and the representatives of the tourism sector. The one that has been cowardly has been the left when it has governed. It should have stood up to them more. Both the PP and the PSOE are what in English are called catch all party, a party that wants to take everything, and they also want to look good with these actors. If you look good with everyone, you don't carry out a transformative policy.

What will be the great political battles of the coming years?

— The whole issue of demographic growth and overcrowding, with everything it entails. It is the consequence of the economic model based on tourism. From this stems the housing problem, the saturation of public services, and the deterioration of natural resources. This is the great challenge.

You have criticized the Balearic Parliament for debating issues unrelated to the Islands, such as the Spanish identity of Ceuta. To what extent do the interests of state-level parties contaminate a debate that should be focused on Balearic affairs?

— Absolutely. The PP has allowed itself to be completely dragged along by Vox, and they come here only to erode Mr. Pedro Sánchez. It is a disgrace. And this began at the start of the legislature. That the President of the Government uses the control session of the Parliament of the Balearic Islands to reinforce the speech that has been dictated to her from Génova Street seems like a fraud to me. We come here to talk about the problems of the citizens of the Balearic Islands. For the Parliament to declare itself in favor of the Spanish nature of Ceuta is absurd and is not what it is supposed to do. Both the PP and Vox, and often the PSOE, use this stage to conduct debates in national terms.

Can you make a ranking of the best speakers you have met over these years as a deputy?

— Jaume Font (El Pi), Sílvia Tur (Gent per Formentera), from past legislatures. And Teresa Suárez (PSIB) and Lluís Apesteguia (MÉS per Mallorca), from this one.